good ol' fannish tunnel vision, let me show you it

[scarfman]

It's filtering through onto my flist this week that there's now a campaign from Kirk/Spock slashers demanding that the relationship be portrayed onscreen in the name of homosexual rights. Fannish homosexuals' reaction to this is that their fight is being misappropriated, in the name of a single if pervasive fannish meme rather than in terms of genuine civil rights issues. There's also concern that whatever progress has been made by the Spock-Uhura relationship in terms of minority advancement (whatever you may consider that to be) would be lost. I have to say I agree with the critics.

I also wonder whether the campaign seriously believes that it can succeed. I don't think the mass audience would go for it, and I'm certain it's more risk than the franchise owner is interested in. I foresee a day when there's a new reenvision of the property that adopts that perspective on the lead characters, but I'm sure that day is farther off than it'll take to make the next film.

Update: A flistmember, who's paid more attention to the situation than I since I brought it to her attention, reports that the campaign has widened its focus from just the one 'ship to the whole LGBT spectrum, but she suspects that the damage to their credibility is already done.

Comments

[omorka.livejournal.com]

I'd love to see a sympathetic gay relationship portrayed somewhere in Trek, but I don't much care who it is. I'm a multishipper; I can handle it if it's not one of my pet pairs - but as it stands, the canon is too straight to be believed.

[daibhid-c.livejournal.com]

Have you read the Next Gen novel Section 13: Rogue? It's about Lt Hawk from First Contact and his partner Ranul Keru.

Keru goes on to be Riker's security chief in the USS Titan books (and I think he was in Worlds of Deep Space Nine: Trill), but as far as I can recall hasn't had another relationship as yet.

[fisher-queen.livejournal.com]

I signed the petition and stuff. Not because I particularly care if it goes K/S but because, like the other commenter here said, I'd like to see that sort of relationship in Star Trek. I mean really, there are so many opportunities for that sort of thing in the new franchise that it doesn't really matter to me who it is.

Now, I don't think petition is really going to work but I'm hoping that it gets people at Paramount thinking in that direction, like maybe they wouldn't go for Kirk/Spock, but would consider Sulu/Chekov, Chapel/Rand, Riley/Ensign Ricky, Whoever/Whoever.

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

I think Abrams is more concerned with explosions and eye candy for the male gaze than with continuing the minority advancement stuff that Roddenberry was into.

I would love to see Kirk/Spock as a couple on the screen because it would free up Uhura to be more than just the hottie girlfriend. But that's not going to happen. That's what fanfic is for.

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

I am under no misconception that slash reflects the reality of being gay, any more than girl-on-girl movies reflect the reality of being lesbian. :3

I know you're an Abrams fan. :) I'll give him another chance. I know it was only a two hour movie, but... ergh, I dunno what it is exactly. Other characters got their moments to shine and be something. Scotty is the oddball, Chekov is the boy genius, Sulu is the action hero. Uhura is... the girlfriend. It's a Smurfette moment, you know?

[scarfman]

Uhura is the technician whose expertise was critical to Kirk's analysis that let Pike know what was going on at Vulcan before they got there. And, while the argument about her assignment to the Farragut is suggestive, we learn that she's the very best at what she does before we learn that she and Spock are people who kiss each other in elevators. Being the girlfriend may or may not overshadow what else she did in the film, but it's not all she does in the film. It's all she does in the second half, granted, but McCoy - the other lead's emotional support - too fails to actually contribute any expertise (or much support, really, so Uhura has that over him) to the plot in the second half. Really, of all the non-lead regulars, only Uhura and Chekov get good bits in both halves; of the two I haven't mentioned yet, Sulu is reduced to busdriving after the swordfight and Scott doesn't even get on the ship till the second half.

It seems to me that being the girlfriend is only half her bit, and it's twice the bit most of the characters get. Your mileage may vary.

[fourzoas.livejournal.com]

I'm always amazed at the short-sighted rhetorical decisions people make in the name of fannish entitlement. Sure, let's compare our cause to the Civil Rights movement, because clearly getting Kirk and Spock to smooch on mah movie screen/telly is going to usher us into the LGBT promised land etc. etc. etc. and would be as socially significant as, well, everything done in the name of Civil Rights during MLK's lifetime. I'm all for discussion of these kinds of issues in fannish communities, but if the end result is the appropriation of a cause to demand fanservice, then I'll just have to rethink my opinions on that. A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing.

Clearly, Uhura is going to have to go all Rosa Parks on someone's ass to retain her rightful seat on the bus...

[alawston.livejournal.com]

Not that I don't completely agree with the general thrust of your argument here but, um, Uhura and Kirk's snog in TOS was one of the significant milestones in the name of Civil Rights.

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

I'm wondering if that's what's happening -- fans think Trek in the '60s helped civil rights, so why can't it help now? That's a bit too simplistic for my tastes, but I think it might be where they're coming from.

Not sure what I think about the vilification of slash writers as using the civil rights label to further the cause of their own sexual gratification.

[fourzoas.livejournal.com]

I'm sure that on some level that's precisely where that's coming from; I just think that the connection that's being drawn doesn't work as well as they might think it does.

I didn't intend to vilify slash writers in that way at all, and I apologize if my remarks came off as such.

[fourzoas.livejournal.com]

You're absolutely right, and in my ire and haste to get out the door to make a meeting, I pretty much shot myself in the foot! *bad rhetorician*

What frustrates me most is that the entire enterprise of this particular endeavor comes off to me as "give us K/S because that would show us you're pro-LGBT," which I see as flawed and appropriating that cause to serve fan desires to see a dearly held piece of fanon legitimized on the screen, versus "we want to see LGBT representation in ST," which is another issue entirely. What raises my hackles with regard to civil rights isn't the idea that an on-screen LGBT pairing is being compared to advances made during that movement, but that the movement is being simplistically pointed to as justification for fanservice. I guess, at the end of it all, I'm suspicious of motive and don't trust this group as credible in its waving of the LGBT banner. I must also admit that I'm a bit sensitive to this issue at the moment, as I've been watching another discussion play out in the Torchwood fandom for a couple of weeks now.

And yes, the Kirk/Uhura snog was a big moment in the Civil Rights movement, which actually increases my sense that this petition is more about K/S than LGBT issues; while we don't have them all of the time, we have had onscreen representation of homosexual relationships for a while now, and so I don't see the need to specify a particular pairing as a means to pushing us past some boundary that doesn't entirely exist anymore. Note: I'm not suggesting that in either the case of race or sexuality that we're anywhere near where we need to be culturally or socially, just that the K/U kiss was a milestone that a K/S kiss and/or relationship even wouldn't be. It would just be the on-screen inclusion of relationships we already see in the media.

Anyway, sorry for the ramble--and my initial rhetoric!fail. I hope this made my ire a bit clearer.

[antikythera.livejournal.com]

I think that's the most sensible explanation I've heard so far.

[bodybag-pilgrim.livejournal.com]

In all honesty, I'm all for more gay characters on screen - representation is good.

But while the shippers will be fine with their Kirk/Spock, to anyone else that specific partnership would be a huge joke. More likely to be a setback than anything else.

[scarfman]

to anyone else that specific partnership would be a huge joke

You know, you're right. I approached that realization but never quite realized it. (Though I remain certain that there'll be a reenvision one day that does it. Lancelot wasn't French in the first stories he appeared in; but they were French works. Legends are interactive.)

[bodybag-pilgrim.livejournal.com]

Yeah.

The thing is... Trek can't be the first or even the first major thing this time around. At the same time, if a Trek movie displays a gay relationship, it's going to be one of the biggest-profile gay fictional moments of its given year.

And that could be a boost (I can't help thinking that, for example, a Starfleet security officer and his partner is a kick in DADT's teeth) but it can be a bad idea - if it's a joke. A new couple - that's affirmation, in its way, a gay couple in Starfleet in the public eye.

Kirk & Spock, Sulu & Chekhov, whoever - that is, to the public at large, a comedy goldmine. And you don't want your biggest-profile moment of the year to be a joke.

[scarfman]

I fully expect there will be homosexuality in Star Trek long, long before there will ever be screen K/S. K/S will never be the first screen homosexuality in Star Trek. But I'm still certain there will one day be screen K/S. (And I never said it wouldn't be a joke.)

[stoplookingup.livejournal.com]

It's really clear that the people behind this "movement" are clueless about LGBT advocacy AND the history of Star Trek. And fandom. And diplomacy. And Hollywood. And generally everything they just jumped into headfirst.

I politely suggested they try something constructive, like raising money for an LGBT charity.